As many readers will be aware, right across Ireland can be seen the remains of hundreds, possibly thousands, of former fine residences dating from the seventeenth century onwards. Even in ruin their scale makes them prominent marks on the landscape, testaments to our country’s history, witnesses to an order which once prevailed but has now passed. Because of the societal and economic imbalance they represented, many of today’s citizens understandably do not mourn their passing. Nevertheless they are part of the national narrative. We ought at least to know their stories, so that they can better inform our own. Unfortunately their mute condition today often means we know little or nothing of each building’s distinctive tale, of how they came into being and then fell into decline. Once this information was familiar, if only to those who occupied the property, or worked on the estate. Now it has frequently been forgotten and another property’s unique character becomes part of the generic ‘Big House’ story. This seems to be the case with Nettleville, County Cork, yet another ruin about which relatively little information is available.
Around 1630 John Nettles moved here from Herefordshire around 1630: inevitably he is described in Burke’s Landed Gentry of 1871 as springing from ‘an ancient English family’ (perish the thought that anyone’s background might not disappear into the foggiest mists of time). Evidently he flourished here since in 1666 he was confirmed by Charles II in a grant of land of 1,258 acres in Counties Waterford and Cork, although his residence was in the latter at Tourin, later to pass into the ownership of the Musgrave family. It was his second son, Robert Nettles, who came to live on an estate where the remains of Nettleville can now be found. On the failure of this line of the family, the Cork property passed back to the main branch, and in the second half of the 18th century was inherited by Captain Robert Nettles. Ambrose Leet’s 1814 Directory lists Nettleville as occupied by the Rev Bazil Orpin, who had married one of the Nettles daughters. However, his tenure was only temporary. Although Captain Nettles and his wife had five sons, four of them died young either through accidents or in warfare (one, Ensign William Nettles being killed at the Battle of Waterloo). That left a single heir, Richard Nevill-Nettles who on the death of his father in 1828 inherited Nettleville. He in turn was succeeded by his only son Robert Nettles, listed in the 1870s as owning 1,684 acres in County Cork. Seemingly Nettleville was still occupied by the Nettles family at the start of the last century but thereafter there does not appear to be further mention of them, leading to the supposition that they died out. Interestingly in September 1919 the Irish Builder mentions Cork architect Bartholomew O’Flynn being employed at Nettleville to carry out alterations and additions, so evidently someone was still living there.
And so to Nettleville, which in the national register of buildings is listed as being built c.1800, although one suspects this is speculative since what survives of the building makes it difficult to discover any specific design features that would allow more precise dating. The south-facing front of the house, now completely immersed in vegetation, is of two storeys over basement but since the site slopes the rear – which looks down to a point where the river Lee loops around on itself – is of three storeys. On this side, to the east of the house is a single-storey extension with narrow arched niches but there does not seem ever to have been its equivalent to the west. While in the main built of dressed sandstone, the house’s windows feature cut limestone sills and red brick voussoirs; no doubt the whole exterior was originally rendered to give a uniformity of appearance.
A short distance to the south-east lies a large yard, the greater part of which is in better condition than the house it was created to serve. Centred on a fine arched gateway, its pediment extended to accommodate a bell, the yard effectively divides into upper and lower sections, assisted once more by the sloping site. Handsomely constructed, and still, at least in part, serviceable, it demonstrates this was once a thriving estate. Now, however, Nettleville is just another ruin on the Irish landscape and its voice in our historical narrative grows weaker as the old buildings grow closer and closer to complete disappearance.
Well said, again. Somehow we must bridge the gap on preservation. Goal Number 1 for 2017
Query. Robert do you now live in the cork area you used to be based in Dublin ,school gonzaga etc.
Thanks for getting in touch. Neither Cork nor Dublin, altho’ I visit both regularly…
Hi Robert. The Robert Nettles who was living there in the 1870’s married Elizabeth Walton Knolles of Oatlands House, near Kinsale. Her brother was Thomas Walton Knolles – well known as a huntsman with the South Union Hunt. When they married on 20th August 1835, the Belfast Telegraph published this rather ‘racy’ poem to mark the occasion:
‘On Grassy Knolls in beds will settle
The wild and stinging ‘plaguy’ nettle
No sting has it if tightly grasped
No pain it gives when closely clasped.
Now, as we wish no pretty ‘Beth ills,
We give the hint to ‘manage’ Nettles’.
Robert Nettles also features heavily in ‘The Slow Sunrise’ by Michael Galvin – a study of the Land War in West Cork.
Thanks
Fergal
Thank you for this information, all most interesting (and amusing about the poem). It all helps to add to one’s knowledge (and not knowing Mr Galvin’s work I must seek this out…)
Not just the Big Houses but sadly more modest buildings and even gates and their pillars. Grand stone eagles brought to the ground.
Great piece. What a shame that Bill Gates takes no interest in this subject matter.
Indeed, and also a shame many other folk who might take an interest closer to home do not do so…
It’s been a tremendous pleasure reading the Irish Aesthete this year. The posts are always erudite, interesting and beautifully written. Thank you Robert and congratulations on a wonderful achievement.
Well thank you in turn for your kind comments, and wishing you a very Happy Christmas.
Fine article on the Nettleville Estate……wondering if there is a family cemetery there? Happy New Year from Reno Nevada
Thank you for making contact, and belated Happy New Year to you too. As for a cemetery on the Nettleville estate, I certainly didn’t see one. I shall try to remember to ask about this next time I am in the locality (altho’ that may not be in the immediate future…)
I did indeed locate Esther Conran Nettles ,the mother of Ensign William Nettles in the Magourney Graveyard,thanks to Fergal.I know one son was killed from falling off a horse and another died in the Maroon War,leaving one unaccounted for? The Nettles family may have been involved in a publishing company in Cork City. Cheers Bill C.
The majority of the Nettles family are buried in Magourney Graveyard, Coachford, Co. Cork.
Incidentally, Ensign William Nettles, son of Captain Robert Nettles, was killed at Waterloo in 1815. He was with the 52nd Foot. Supposedly he was ‘killed while carrying the King’s Colour, which was found under his body’.
Fergal, thanks for the info. Wm.Nettles had gotten his entry into the 52nd. on a rec from his uncle Captain William Conran of the 21st. unfortunately killed at New Orleans. Capt. Robert Nettles was married to a Conran lass,possibly descended from a Philip Conran mayor of Dublin,..1793 or so. The year they got Trinity up and going. The other Ensign in the 52 nd. was William Leake who wrote the history of that Rgt. Cheers Bill C.
Hi Bill. Do you have an email address? I have a few bits and pieces on the Nettles family I can send on. Thanks. Fergal.
Nettleville burnt down at a family party sometime in the 1940’s or perhaps earlier. A fire brigade had to come from the army barracks in Ballincollig. The family is still held in high regard locally and about 5 years ago there was a historical society organised by the Carrigadrohid Historical Societies held there. There is still a lot of knowledge about the family locally.
Thank you for getting in touch: if you have additional information I should be delighted to receive it.
Hi Eileen.
I would be very interested in talking to you about the house as well.
Thanks
Fergal
I checked Irishnewsarchives.com just now – and according to the Cork Examiner and Southern Star, the house burned down on the night of Monday April 25th 1938. It was owned by Captain Hornby, Joint Master of the Muskerry Hounds. In March 1939, Hornby put the whole place up for sale by Public Auction. Thanks for the lead, Eileen!
Fascinating – now more please! (And thank you for this…)
One further piece of information just discovered. Captain Albert Hornby, who owned Nettleville in the 1920’s and sold it in 1939 had a brother called John Hornby who was an explorer and who perished (literally) on an exploration expedition in North West Canada in April 1927. Two others died along with him – Edgar Christian and Harold Challenor Evan Adlard. Both Captain Albert Hornby of Nettleville and John Hornby were the sons of Mr. A. N. Hornby, a well known Lancashire Cricketer. Among the deceased John Hornby’s possessions found in the cabin in the wastes of North West Canada where the three bodies were found was a letter to Captain Hornby of Nettleville written by his brother while he was presumably dying: ‘Dear Albert. A Farewell line. Edgar will, I trust, return to give you all the news. Love to all. Your very affectionate brother, Jack’.
Hello. A Google search brought me to your article. My name is is Robert Nettle, currently living in Billings, Montana, USA. But I was born and raised in upstate New York. For some unknown reason, the Nettle name was changed from Nettles, by our great grandfather. I have been working on my family tree for sometime now and have been able to trace family via Ancestry.com through upstate New York, into Canada, and to John Nettles born 1805 County Cork. I recently reunited with my cousin, who I found was independently searching our tree. We had both traced our North American roots to John Nettles. We are hoping to expand our search to Ireland. As part of my cousin’s research, he came across Burke’s book of Irish Gentry with a tantalizing possible link to Nettles of Nettleville. But he has been unable to make any connection. Our work continues. My cousin is planning to visit Ireland in the near future to research our John Nettles. So I found your article very interesting. Thank you
Thank you for getting in touch and I am delighted what I wrote was of interest, and possibly of assistance, to you and your cousin. I wish that I could help more but I am not a genealogist. Best of luck with your research…
Robert Nettle:
Hello!
I am a decedent of Joanna Nettles (1841-1893) and George A. Nettles (1838-1915). George was born 7/23/1838 in Stormont, Ontario Canada and died 5/18/1915 in Parishville Rd., Potsdam, NY.
Georges parents were John Nettles (1805-1870) and Elizabeth (Betsey) McCann Nettles (1810-1870). John was born in Kilnenny, Ireland. He died on 6/24/1870 in Massena, NY. This is our connection cousin! John Nettles immigrated to Canada and then to Upstate NY in the Massena area.
I think his father was Richard Neville Nettles (1780-1851) born and died in Nettleville, Co Cork, Ireland and his wife was Anne Gibbs (Married in 1804)
Richard’s father was Robert Nettles who died in 12/7/1832 in Nettleville, Co Cork, Ireland. His wife was Esther or Hester Conran (-1807)-Died 12/7/1832 in Nettleville as well.
My email address is airisu92@gmail.com if you want to connect with me.
Sincerely,
Julie Brooks
This is fascinating! I am a direct descendant of the Nettles family. My grandfather was a Robert Nettles, and I have inherited some family items dated to 1872 also belonging to a Robert Nettles living at Nettleville. I also have a bundle of very old family papers – mainly relating to early legal and financial transactions. I am neither a genealogist nor a historian, had always intended to travel to County Cork from London, where I live, but am now disabled and haven’t yet been able to plan a trip. I’d be interested to know more, especially to find any museums or research bodies who might be custodians of information. Thank you for all the research so far, and if you have any ideas, do please let me know. Very best wishes.
Hi Monica!
I am a descent of Robert Nettles as well.
The big question is why they didn’t retain Nettleville.
My Nettle descendant immigration to Canada, then Upstate NY.
I would love to share information with you!
Perhaps this is a tiny part of a vanishing narrative reconnecting itself?
Hi Monica. There is a small museum in Kilmurray which would be close to Nettleville. I have a small but of information on the family as Robert Nettles married a Knolles lady from Belgooly – where I come from myself. I would love to correspond with you about the estate as I’ve been looking into its history for a couple of years. My email address is Kilmonoge@hotmail.com.
The local historical society in Canovee has reports from living memory and there are photos of Nettleville burning in the 1938 – an accident rather than a political event it would appear. The owner, Hornby, who presumably got it from the Nettles, decided not to rebuild and sold the place in various parts by auction to local farmers. The late John Lucey ended up with the part where the house now stands and built a bungalow in the late 1950’s in front of the courtyard.His family are still there and a further modern house was build a few years ago just behind the ruin.
Hi Peter. Would you have a contact details for the Canovee historical society?
Thanks
Fergal